Hank Smith:                      00:00:00             Coming up in this episode on followHIM.

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     00:00:03             I remember coming home from a long Sunday, walking home, the two blocks from the church to my home when usually my kids come running in and I was able to see the excitement in the kids that I haven’t seen for much of the day. On this day, I came in and the house was quiet. I walk in the kitchen and my son Austin is eating a bowl of cereal. He doesn’t even acknowledge that I’m walking in the home. I walk in and I see the kitchen.

Hank Smith:                      00:00:37             Hello everyone. Welcome to another episode of followHIM. My name is Hank Smith. I am your host. I’m here with my cohost, John Bytheway, whose heart is honest and his spirit trite. John, I was reading section 97 verse eight. I don’t think I’ve ever seen this phrase before. The Lord says, I know your heart is honest. John, that’s you.

John Bytheway:               00:00:59             I’ve got some cholesterol in there too, but, I have meds now.

Hank Smith:                      00:01:04             Yeah, I think if you went to the cardiologist, he would say you have a very honest heart. It’s honestly very clogged.

John Bytheway:               00:01:12             That’s right.

Hank Smith:                      00:01:12             John, we are honored today to have with us brother Clint Mortensen.

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     00:01:17             Thank you. A delight to be here.

Hank Smith:                      00:01:19             John, I have known Clint Mortensen for a very long time. He is as honest in heart as you are. Two out of the three of us are really honest in heart today. Church has been organized now two years. They’re growing like crazy. What comes to mind when you think of, we’ve got our two church centers, Ohio and Missouri, and there’s a lot of growth.

John Bytheway:               00:01:43             In these sections when we look at the New Testament, this the center of everything was the temple and the Old Testament. The Lord has this urgency about, Hey, would you guys get with it? With the temple. One of the things I love about the restoration is this whole emphasis on temples again.

Hank Smith:                      00:01:59             We started as kind of a Protestant church. Then we start talking priesthood and sacrament, so now we’re kind of Catholic and then let’s go back to temples. Now we’re going way back. Clint, what are we looking at today? Where are we going to go?

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     00:02:11             I think there’s about five things that I’d love to spend some time on. First and foremost, the Lord’s going to chasten and correct his people, and that’s always a unique thing to learn in scripture. Something that’s very challenging for us that we get to observe the Savior do. Then we’ll transition and talk about light and darkness. There’s a phrase that he uses, walk in darkness at noonday. We will dive into the light of the Savior and what that might mean. We’ll spend some time then on revelation, how powerful it is in a time like this, in a difficult time with persecution and poverty, the Lord commanding them to build a temple. They’re having a hard time completing such the task, yet he’s consistently teaching them and giving them revelation. Then we’ll transition into and spend a lot of time talking about temples, both the commandment that the Savior gives for them to build temples, but we’ll also spend some time with President Russell M. Nelson and what we’re hearing today regarding temple work and we’ll end with President Nelson’s statement. This is a statement that’s unfamiliar to a lot of people because it wasn’t in general conference where he says, the greatest gift you could give the Lord is… We’ll spend some time answering that question as far as the greatest gift we can give the Lord from President Russell M. Nelson. We’ll cover those five things and jump in and out of section 94, 95, 96, and 97 and spend a lot of time with President Russell M. Nelson.

Hank Smith:                      00:03:48             I’m excited for today. Now, John, I have known Clint a long time. You’ve known him about an hour here since we sat down but you have a bio for him.

John Bytheway:               00:04:00             Brother Clint or President in some circles. President Clint B. Mortensen was born and raised in Springville, Utah. I know that’s a place that you love Hank. He met his wife, Natilee Bird in high school when they were both asked to speak in sacrament meeting together. Did the bishop know? After his mission to Neuquén Argentina, they were married in the Salt Lake Temple in 1994. They are the parents of four children and four grandchildren. Brother Clint earned a bachelor’s degree from the University of Utah in business management, a master’s degree from Utah State University in family science. Since being hired in 1997 in seminaries and institutes his assignments have included seminary teacher, principal, institute teacher, pre-service trainer and director, area director and assistant administrator. He served in various callings in the church, including young men’s president, stake high council, twice as bishop currently serving as stake president in the Springville Utah stake. This is the same stake where Natilee and Clint met in August of 1990, giving talks in sacrament meeting. That’s super cool. I think our audience would love to hear, tell us about your assignment with seminaries and institutes because you’ve been there a long time.

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     00:05:16             Oh, thank you. It’s been an absolute delight spending almost 30 years with the youth and the young adults. It’s incredible to see what’s happening in seminaries and institutes. We’ve got about 70,000 teachers around the world. 95% of them are volunteers. It’s been incredible to see what’s happening. Last year we had over 900,000 seminary and institute students in 124 countries speaking 38 languages. That’s the highest we’ve ever seen. In fact, this last year, seminaries and institutes, we had an increase of 90,000 seminary students. Next year, John and Hank, we are hoping, we are praying, we are working, and when I say we, it’s volunteers, it’s teachers, it’s leaders, it’s missionaries. By the end of this next school year, we can reach 1 million around the world. We’re often asked where this growth is coming from. I think it’s connected well to what President Nelson said. You’ll remember him saying, do you see what is happening right before your eyes?

                                           00:06:25             I pray that we will not miss the majesty of this moment. The Lord is indeed hastening his work. We’re seeing it in seminaries and institutes. What a blessing. Then you add the other CES institutions like BYU, BYU Idaho, BYU Hawaii, BYU pathway, Ensign College, and this church educational system is incredible. In fact, I think it’s fulfilling President Nelson’s invitation when he said, gaining an education is not just a privilege, it’s a religious responsibility. Indeed, our education is for the eternities. We’re seeing a really large increase in students, but the real miracle, I think, John, in asking about seminaries and institutes is what’s happening in the hearts of the students. I was in Texas a while ago. There was some training that had been completed and this sweet volunteer teacher was asked, after this day of training, in a week, you’re going to be spending some time teaching your 15 students in early morning seminary. What did you learn today that will help you?

                                           00:07:33             Her statement summarized the real miracle in the hearts of these 900,000 students when she said, well, I think it’s about students learning by the Spirit as they study the scriptures to come closer to the Savior. That’s been the highlight for me and tens of thousands of other teachers around the world. To see a young man or to see a young woman have an experience in seminary where the spirit speaks to them and draws them closer to the Savior, there’s nothing like it. What a blessing to be a part of such a great organization.

Hank Smith:                      00:08:10             Yeah, you know, I was in seminaries and institutes. It’s called S&I now. I was there for 12 years.

John Bytheway:               00:08:19             In Springville too, right?

Hank Smith:                      00:08:20             Yeah in Springville. It’s where Clint and I’s path, we just keep crossing every couple of years. I was a seminary teacher at Springville High School. I was a red devil for two and a half years, and I loved it there. I feel like I’m an honorary Springville graduate.

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     00:08:35             You are Hank.

Hank Smith:                      00:08:35             and I taught Clint’s one daughter, Mackenzie, and her husband, wasn’t husband at the time, but her husband, Hunter, who we all called Hummer, Hummer Frampton, and Mackenzie Frampton now. Golden kids, the perfect seminary students. My 12 years in seminaries changed me. I think about the people I taught with, the students I taught. The Lord is in that program. I remember Elder Packer saying, once this program, seminaries & Institutes was started when it was helpful but not necessarily needed, and now it’s absolutely crucial to our work.

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     00:09:16             And you know what, Hank, I think I speak for thousands of parents and leaders in thanking you, Hank, not only for the difference that you made for my children, but I think about the 70,000 teachers literally more than that. If you look at how many teachers have taught around the world for the last 20, 30, 40 years, what a blessing the teachers are around the world as they make sacrifices, as they get up early, as they stay up late preparing their lessons, most of whom are volunteers. Sincerely to you, Hank to you, John, all of those wonderful teachers around the world that are having such a deep impact on the youth and the young adults of the church. It’s a miracle.

Hank Smith:                      00:10:00             Yeah. Since Clint was talking about seminary teachers, I need to thank one, I don’t even know his name. Go back to Granger High School. It’s 1962. There’s three girls walking back to the school from lunch. Two of them say to the one girl, her name’s Cindy. Cindy, you should come with us to seminary. She said, oh, you guys know I don’t go to church, and they said, no, no, no. This isn’t like church. This is fun. Cindy, her parents were heavy, heavy smokers. Everything smelled like smoke. Clothes, right? Her hair, her skin even. Everything smelled like cigarette smoke and she just did not feel comfortable at church, obviously, they talk about the word of wisdom and they said, no, no, no, you’ll like it. It’s not like that. She said, all right, I’ll come with you. I don’t really want to go to biology, right, or whatever she had.

                                           00:10:51             She goes over to the seminary building and it was the teacher, it was his smile. It was his friendliness. You know? It wasn’t even necessarily in exactly what he taught, but it was how he taught it. She had never seen a happy marriage, here he was talking about his wife, how wonderful his wife is. She was really struck by this, so she kept missing biology, and going to seminary. Finally, the seminary teacher said, listen, you gotta sign up if you’re going to keep coming, so she did. She signed up. That was her junior year of high school. She signed up. Then she signed up again her senior year of high school. From that seminary class, she decided she wanted to be married in the temple. She applied to BYU. This is back when you could get in. She ends up going to BYU and meeting my dad. That’s my mom. Cindy’s my mom. One day in the next life, I’m going to get to find out who those two girls were and who that seminary teacher was. I hope to show the three of them my family, the people I’ve taught, this show, none of this happens if those two girls don’t invite my mom to seminary. Having you here, Clint really touches my heart.

John Bytheway:               00:12:06             And Hank, you used the word invite. I’m here because my dad came home from the war and he said, I started dating some LDS girls and of all the LDS girls I dated, only two ever invited me to church, so I went to sacrament meeting with one, firesides with the other. The one that he went to sacrament meeting with is my mom because she invited him.

Hank Smith:                      00:12:28             Invited. That’s all it was an invitation.

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     00:12:32             Actually. We’ve seen that John and Hank, the youth and the young single adults today are some of the strongest inviters. I think that’s part of the reason that we’re seeing such growth in seminaries and institutes, the youth and the young adults they invite, so maybe as we as parents or as adults or as leaders, when we’re in a classroom or we’re sitting around the table talking about seminary or institute, we might want to ask them, so who are you going to invite? We often ask, what are you learning in seminary and institute? Which is a great question, but another question is, is there someone you know, member, non-member, friend of another faith coming to church, not coming to church, who can you invite to seminary or institute? Because the data shows that when someone enrolls in seminary and institute and they’re a non-member, one in three of them will be baptized. That’s just incredible at the covenant path and the gathering of Israel and the role that seminary and institute plays. Hank you and your family, you’re a great example of that.

Hank Smith:                      00:13:39             Wow. We love helping seminaries and institute teachers. John, we hear from them all the time. They say, Hey, I listen to your show when I’m preparing, it helps give me ideas for what I’m going to do for my class. Let’s extend a little bit of an invitation then, if you’re a seminary teacher, volunteer, full-time, come onto YouTube or come to our website, follow him.co. Send us a message. We would love to share those with Clint and his team or maybe a seminary, you were a seminary student once or an institute student and it really changed trajectory for you. Come on to YouTube and leave us a comment. Tell us that story. We’ll make sure Clint hears and sees all of those. It would be really fun to see how Seminary’s Institutes has impacted our listeners.

John Bytheway:               00:14:26             Clint, when you were talking about growth and use the word increase, I hope people were hearing those words because there’s a lot of other narratives out there that just aren’t true. There’s growth and there’s increase. 70,000. I mean, I was thinking about the number of missionaries and you have a similar number of teachers out there. How wonderful is that. Things are growing and increasing. Thank you for putting it that way. I hope everybody heard that.

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     00:14:54             John, as you mentioned that I had a sweet experience just a couple of months ago. It was outside of Chicago, a small class of 14, 15 students, six in the morning. We’ve often heard the experience shared in a seminary class where a student arrives. They couldn’t find their keys. They were late, and that was the experience that this sweet young woman had shared. That morning was, I couldn’t find my keys. I was late to seminary and I prayed and I found the keys and it was such a tender moment. Then this wonderful inspired teacher said, what does that tell you about the Savior? That he would help you find your keys early in the morning on the way to seminary, this sweet young sister shared a tender testimony about the Savior. I sat in the back and thought, this is what seminary is about. A dedicated young woman coming to seminary and an inspired teacher asking a question to help that young woman see the Savior in her life. It was inspiring, and that happens all around the world. It’s fantastic.

Hank Smith:                      00:16:01             Yeah. You’re filling my heart here with love overflowing. If there’s any of my little former seminary students out there, Snow Canyon High School, Copper Hills High School, Park City High School, Springville High School, I love you, I still love you after all these years. I still love you. I was speaking out in Texas and I had one of my former seminary students, I hadn’t talked to her in 10, 15 years. She knew I was coming, so she shot me a message. She said, Hey, I’m going to come see you speak out in Dallas I think we were in. I said, I would love to chat with you, and I’d spoke at this event and afterwards she hung out and I got to talk with her. I said, how are you? We exchanged just some updates and then she just started to weep. I said, Hey, hey, what’s wrong?

                                           00:16:50             She said, Brother Smith, I’m getting a divorce, and I said, oh, I’m so sorry. I’m so sorry, and she said something that just, I knew I chose the right career. She said, I just want to talk to my seminary teacher, and I said, I’m here. I’m here. Let’s talk. It was just a moment where I thought, I love seminary and institute. Okay, I’m going to start crying if we don’t get going here, let’s jump in. Doctrine & Covenants 94 through 97 For the Salvation of Zion. I’m going to read from the, Come, Follow Me manual. It says, anciently, the Lord commanded Moses to build a tabernacle according to the pattern showed to him in the Mount. The tabernacle was to be the center of Israel’s wilderness camp. In 1833, the Lord commanded Joseph Smith to build temples, not after the manner of the world, but rather after the manner which I shall show.

                                           00:17:51             Like the tabernacle in the wilderness, the temple was meant to be a central feature in Kirtland. Today, temples are found around the world. Even if they aren’t at the center of our cities, they point us to Christ who should be the center of our lives. Though each temple differs in appearance within them, we learn the same divine pattern, a heavenly plan to bring us back into the presence of God. Sacred ordinances and covenants connect us to Christ and strengthen our families, not after the manner of the world, but after the pattern God shows us. I’m excited. Clint, how should we start this lesson?

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     00:18:29             That’s such a great summary of the context of what’s happening here. We may know that in early publications of the Doctrine & Covenants, the revelation recorded in section 94 was incorrectly dated as May 6th, 1833, but now we know that the correct date is August 2nd, 1833. Why does this matter? Because today, as we go through section 94, 95, 96 and 97, section 95 and 96 are both in June of 1833. Section 97 and 94 are in August of 1833. In fact, early manuscripts show that section 94 is actually the last part likely of the revelation in section 97. You can group these four sections into section 95 and 96 in June, section 97 and 94 in August. Again, a quick summary that the people in Zion or Missouri, they’re seeing persecution, they’re seeing mobs, they’re being forced out of their homes and lands. While in Kirtland, generally the saints are poor, they’re deep in debt. They lack resources to build a community. Joseph’s having to borrow funds to build church buildings and temples. That’s the context that we’re in. As you mentioned, Hank, with these two church centers. Maybe as we jump into a few of these verses, let me ask you a question. How much do you enjoy correcting or disciplining John and Hank? Is that something you love to do whether you’re teaching or as a parent?

Hank Smith:                      00:20:05             I probably avoid that more than I should. That’s tough, especially as a parent, you feel like, I need to do this. In the church, as a church leader, that’s tough. It’s probably easier to avoid. John, what do you think?

John Bytheway:               00:20:20             Yeah, you used the word easy. It’s easier just to say, oh, you’re great. You’re fine. If you really love somebody, then you do that tough work trying to help.

Hank Smith:                      00:20:33             And it’s your role, right? You’re the steward.

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     00:20:36             Yeah. I was informed last year that I was terrible at this as a father. My children around the dinner table laughed and said, dad, anytime you discipline, it was this. You’d finally say, okay, go to your room you’re grounded. We’d go up in the room, 10 or 15 minutes later you’d show up and say, oh, are you okay? And we’d say, yeah, I’m kind of sad. Well, did you learn your lesson? We’d say, yeah, I learned my lesson. Okay, come downstairs. You’re not grounded anymore, and that was my approach to discipline, at least what my children informed me of years later, but it really is hard. John, you said, when we really love, I think what a beautiful principle. You’ll notice in section 88 is received in December of 1832. The Lord commands them to build a temple, to build a house of prayer, a house of fasting, a house of faith, a house of learning.

                                           00:21:29             We’re now about five months later and there’s virtually no progress on the temple. The scriptures are full of examples of the Savior correcting other people. In fact, if you ever want to just sit down and say, how do I correct? How do I discipline? How do I chasten? Prayerfully consider that and study the scriptures. The Savior corrects Peter and Paul and Nephi and Laman and Lemuel and Moses. In these verses, the Savior’s actually correcting Joseph Smith and these early church leaders. If we can go to Doctrine & Covenants section 97, I want to just read verses one through three with this question. What does the Savior teach us about effective correction or discipline or if we want to use the scriptural term chastening? What I’d love to do is study and look at three verses in section 95 verses one, two, and three with this primary question, what does the Savior teach us about effective correction or discipline or chastening?

                                           00:22:35             Verse one of section 95, verily thus saith the Lord unto you, whom I love. Whom I love I also chasten that their sins may be forgiven. For with the chastisement, I prepare a way for their deliverance in all things out of temptation, and I have loved you. Verse two, wherefore you must needs be chastened and stand rebuked before my face. Verse three, for ye have sinned against me, a very grievous sin in that you have not considered the great commandment in all things that I have given unto you concerning the building of my house. Any thoughts, John or Hank as you look at those three verses, what can we learn knowing that correction and discipline is hard? What can we learn from the Savior and how he addresses correcting and disciplining in others?

Hank Smith:                      00:23:28             There is so much to learn here. It’s drenched in love. He says that, I love you. I have loved you. To me, there has to be a basis of I know this person chastening me, in this case the Lord, loves me. This is where it’s coming from. It’s coming from love.

John Bytheway:               00:23:48             When you know someone loves you, you listen differently. That’s not a pretended love, but when you know somebody really cares about you, you honestly evaluate what they’re saying perhaps better.

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     00:23:59             Yeah, I really appreciate the Savior and that phrase that their sins may be forgiven. You can sense in the Savior, his goodness, his love, his kindness, the desire is that sins will be forgiven. That change and repentance and forgiveness is the end of that love. I also really appreciate, and I’ve seen this in my life, that the Savior will prepare a way for their deliverance out of the temptation that we experience. He uses the word needs in verse two. Wherefore, ye must needs be chastened and stand rebuked before my face. I’m so grateful for the Savior and his goodness. I see that there are some principles and practices we can learn here about correction. I remember early on in my life, in fact in this very ward where I met my sweet wife, Natilee, I had my mission call to Argentina. I was meeting with Bishop Walker.

                                           00:24:58             My dad and I worked, meeting with him to prepare for the farewell that we called it back in the day where the whole program was for this missionary. Gratefully that’s changed, but I was sitting there. My dad and I were on one side of the desk and Bishop Walker was on the other side. He said, so Clint, what are your thoughts on what do you want the program to look like? So I pull out of my suit coat this paper where I had written the exact program. It was all of my siblings and my mom and my dad. Then me at the end, and I was so excited to have them fill up the entire time so that I would just share my testimony. The bishop said, Clint, I don’t think you’re going to be able to spend a lot of time teaching and testifying and preparing for your mission if you don’t speak. And I’m like, okay, Bishop, that’s really nice of you, but I really want to hear… We kind of had this tension between this young missionary and a bishop.

                                           00:25:56             I looked at my dad and said, dad, don’t you like this program? My father in his simplistic approach to discipline said, son, I promise you in your life you’ll be blessed if you follow the council and suggestion of your leaders. I felt it even sharing this experience now I can still feel the difference that that made when my father simply said, you would be wise to follow your leaders. I’m grateful for kind and candid, firm and friendly correction. I can still remember the tone that my father used in correcting me in this moment. What a powerful moment that was for me.

Hank Smith:                      00:26:39             Yeah, I think I need to do a quick shout out to a good friend of all three of ours. His name’s Tyler Griffin. Tyler is a member of your stake presidency?

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     00:26:50             Yes.

Hank Smith:                      00:26:51             Fantastic teacher. I had a moment of impact. I’m sure he remembers this if he’s listening, he was in my classroom, it was a few years ago, BYU, maybe it was more than a few years ago now. Right after a class, he pulled me aside and said, Hey, can I talk to you really quick about something? I knew he loved me, and I said, sure, sure. He was very direct and he said, here’s exactly what was said. Here is why that could have some negative impact. Then followed up with, you’re a fantastic teacher and I love you. I’ve never forgotten it. I wasn’t angry at him. I wasn’t frustrated. He had shown me something I just had not seen. It was something I was blind to. It needed to be fixed or I was not going to have the impact I hoped to have.

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     00:27:39             Aren’t we grateful for people like that who love us enough to correct us and we see that so powerfully illustrated in these verses with the Savior. In fact, in President Nelson’s book, Father, Surgeon, Apostle, this experience with Elder Christofferson has shared where shortly after being called to the 70, Elder D. Todd Christofferson accompanied Elder Nelson, now President Russell M. Nelson on a stake conference assignment to Mexico. After the conference, Elder Christofferson said, Elder Nelson, if at any time I need correction, please feel free to give it to me. Elder Nelson’s response, I will. That is one of the ways we show love for one another, and I am so thankful for those who love me and love us enough that even in those difficult circumstances can correct us and I appreciate that and that might be an invitation for all of us this week. Find a time this week where we can ask someone that we trust, someone that we know loves us.

                                           00:28:47             Hey, can you gimme some feedback? Can you give me a suggestion? I think we will be surprised at this inspiring nature that the Savior himself will inspire them to teach and correct us. In fact, I think there’s another element of correction that Elder Christofferson also teaches us in April of 2011 in his general conference talk. As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten, he said this, I would like to speak of one particular attitude and practice we need to adopt if we are going to meet our Heavenly Father’s high expectations and it is this; being willing to accept and even seek correction. If we are open to it needed correction will come in many forms and many sources. It may come in the course of our prayers as God speaks to our minds and to our heart through the Holy Ghost. Elder Bednar said, if you haven’t been rebuked by the Holy Ghost in your personal prayers lately, I’d recommend you improve the meaningfulness of your personal prayers.

                                           00:29:55             I really believe that the Savior in this case is going to correct the saints for not building a temple after five months of being commanded to do so, but I also believe that a loving father in heaven who loves us and wants us to progress daily will answer that prayer. When we ask him for correction, for chastening, for disciplining that through the power of the Holy Ghost, he will regularly correct us. I remember coming home from a long Sunday walking home the two blocks from the church to my home when usually my kids come running in and I was able to see the excitement in the kids that I haven’t seen for much of the day. On this day I came in and the house was quiet. I walk in the kitchen and my son Austin is eating a bowl of cereal. He doesn’t even acknowledge that I’m walking in the home.

                                           00:30:54             I walk in and I see the kitchen and it’s spotless and I sit next to Austin. I’m like, Austin, how is the kitchen so clean? Wait, Austin, that was your chore for the day and Austin has not even looked at me. He’s looking at the back of the box eating his cereal and I said, so Austin, why did you clean the kitchen? Without eye contact he said, dad, because I knew if I didn’t clean the kitchen you’d yell at me and I didn’t want you to yell at me. And I walk out, sit in the living room, I have this moment speaking of heaven and correction, where I recognized that I needed to change. That moment changed me, and I am so thankful for those small moments in life, in a car, in a home, in a classroom where the power of the Holy Ghost and a loving Father will correct us, not just in the big things to build a temple, but in the small things to improve our worship of the Savior.

John Bytheway:               00:31:59             I think that willingness to ask is the man who came to Jesus and said, what lack I yet? and I don’t know about you guys, but I think I would be so afraid to ask that question.

Hank Smith:                      00:32:12             I think the Lord would say to me, do you want it alphabetical or chronological? How much time do you have? Right? What lack I yet?

John Bytheway:               00:32:20             For Elder Christofferson to say, if you see anything, that’s really a good example.

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     00:32:27             Yeah it’s a different level of humility, isn’t it?

Hank Smith:                      00:32:30             Yeah. I noticed something in almost every story we’ve shared here, the person doing the correcting often has that role in that person’s life. President Nelson to Elder Christofferson, your dad to you, Tyler is my associate dean. I was one of the teachers. It’s a parent’s role. What caution is there for those of us who think, well, my bishop’s doing something wrong and I’m in the ward. Should I go tell him?

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     00:32:59             Hank, that’s such a great question. I trust a loving heavenly father to inspire the individual to approach it with the right tone and in the right way. I have a video, this is terrible that I have a video of my 2, 3-year-old daughter in a high chair. I’m looking at her and I say, Mackenzie, I love you, I love you, and I’m saying the right words, but the tone is not the right tone. She actually, in the video starts crying as a father is telling her she’s loved, but it’s the wrong tone and we’ve heard this, that you can sometimes say the right thing in the wrong tone and actually say the wrong thing. In this case, Hank with your great, great question. I would hope if I’m taking that approach, whether it’s with a bishop or somebody else, that I would make that a matter of prayer and say, heavenly Father, how do I help? Will you inspire me to say the right thing in the right tone? I really believe Heavenly Father will answer that prayer.

Hank Smith:                      00:34:11             I love that, Clint. That was wonderful. We’re three verses in and I’m already thinking, okay, I’ve got to change some things. What do we do next?

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     00:34:19             Interesting we often ask ourselves, okay, that was the correction, how did these church leaders respond? Well, immediately after being chastened Hyrum Smith runs to the temple site and says, we are preparing to build a house of the Lord and I am determined to be the first at work. I admire these church leaders for being corrected, being chastened by a loving heavenly Father and immediately responding. Then there’s a building committee made up of Hyrum Smith, Jared Carter and Reynolds Cahoon. They write a letter to the saints and this is what that letter says. After being chastened by the Savior, we feel under obligation to write you. Unless we fulfill this commandment, we may all despair of obtaining the great blessing that God has promised to the faithful of the church of Christ. Therefore, brethren, we write this epistle to you to stir up your minds, to make the exertion which the Lord requires of you.

                                           00:35:19             May we all be kept by the grace of God unto eternal life. Amen. I’m so thankful for the quick response that these incredible leaders make. In fact, if you’ll notice in section 95 and 96, the first sections in June of 1833, you see phrases like whom I love, I also chasten. They stand rebuked. They walk in darkness. If you notice in section 97 and 94, this is how these two sections begin. Verse one of section 94, verily I say unto you my friends, verse one of section 97, verily I say unto you my friends. Well, what happened in those two months? What may have changed that the tone of the latter sections began with my friends? In John chapter 15, verse 14, the Savior says, ye are my friends if ye do whatsoever I command you. I wonder if part of the reason why the beginning of those sections in 94 and 97 are different because they had repented. You’ve got people like Hyrum running to the temple, building out the fences, beginning to dig the line for the foundation. I’m so thankful that it wasn’t just about a loving father who chasten his people, but it was the response of these early saints to actually change and repent.

Hank Smith:                      00:36:55             Yeah, they moved. They acted. It reminds me of, my children complain to my wife and I that we leave them on red, which I didn’t quite understand what that meant for a long time, but what it means is they’ve sent us a text message and we don’t respond. It’s hurtful to them. Why did you leave me on read and I feel like the Lord is saying that in 95 and 96, Hey, why did you leave me on red? And then the response when they actually don’t leave him on read in 94 and 97, he’s ah, you, there is a relationship here, right? You are responding to me.

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     00:37:35             Couple of verses to be careful of. In section 95, verse 11, the Savior says, verily I say unto you, it is my will that you should build a house. If you keep my commandments, ye shall have power to build it. Verse 12 says, if ye keep not my commandments, the love of the Father shall not continue with you. Robert Millet and Lloyd Newell gave a great insight to this verse in their book Drawn Near Unto Me. That really was a blessing to me where they said passages such as Doctrine & Covenants 95 verse 12, occasionally lead individuals who have been guilty of serious sin to feel helpless, to conclude that they’re no longer loved by God. In truth, however, God loves all his children, even those who are guilty of a major transgression. These passages of scripture teach us not that God loves one child more than another, but rather that one who keeps the commandments places oneself in a position to receive and enjoy the blessings of the Almighty.

                                           00:38:45             Boy, I testify that that’s true. Heavenly Father loves all his children. Heavenly Father loves his children who make mistakes. Heavenly father loves his children who five months after being asked to do something are still working on that same thing. I’m grateful for Elder Christofferson’s invitation for me to consider how to willingly accept and seek correction. This is a plan of progression. We thank God for his correction. I hope I can be like Hyrum Smith that when that correction comes, I’m the first one to go and dig. I testify that the Savior is willing to teach. He’s so patient with each of us in our discipleship and connection and relationship with him.

Hank Smith:                      00:39:32             Hmm, wouldn’t you say, Clint, that one of those, if you keep not my commandments, is to repent. He might be saying, if you’re not repenting, you’re going to walk in darkness.

John Bytheway:               00:39:43             Right in first Nephi chapter one verse one, which we’ve all read, and having been highly favored of the Lord and I’ve thought, does God have favorites? As you keep reading one Nephi, you come across 1 Nephi 17, the Lord esteemeth all flesh in one. He that is righteous is favored of God. Righteous just means you’re repenting. God doesn’t choose that status, we do, because we have the opportunity to repent, so I like to say there’s Lamanites, there’s Nephites and there’s Favorites. We get to be Favorites if we choose to repent. When I see 95 verse 12, I think the favor of the Father will continue with you.

Hank Smith:                      00:40:23             Clint, I really appreciate that you brought that thought from Brother Millet and Brother Newell of there might be people listening who think, that’s me. I haven’t kept the commandments. I don’t have the love of the Father with me and I’m walking in darkness. I love that you said, wait, wait, wait. Hold on. This is from Elder Renlund. This is a talk called Latter-day Saints Keep on Trying. April, 2015, he said, even if we’ve been a conscious deliberate sinner, you’re not thinking, I didn’t make a mistake, I actually sought out this sin. Even if we’ve been a conscious deliberate sinner or have repeatedly faced failure and disappointment, the moment we decide to try again, the atonement of Christ can help us and we need to remember that it is not the Holy Ghost that tells us we’re so far gone that we might as well give up.

John Bytheway:               00:41:20             I love that. One of the Savior’s titles, I think it’s my favorite, at least today it is, I could change my mind tomorrow, is Advocate, that he advocates for us. As Section 45 taught us so beautifully that one of Satan’s names is the Accuser. When you feel those kind of messages, the Savior wouldn’t do that, he’s not the accuser. He’s an advocate. Remember what Sister Runia said in General Conference, I mean the title of her talk, that our repentance doesn’t burden the Lord it adds to his joy. You feel that way, just keep trying as Elder Renlund said.

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     00:41:56             Yeah, and how grateful we are, all of us, for the power of repentance. I’m thankful for President Nelson reminding us and reminding me of the beauty of daily repentance. There’s that phrase, Hank, I think you touched on it a minute ago in verse six of section 95, walking in darkness at noonday. Verse 12. Again, walk in darkness, but that phrase, walking in darkness at noonday. Noonday implying the sun is at its peak, it’s warm, it’s hot, it’s light. Yet how can I walk in darkness at noonday? As a reminder in the context of this section, we’re about five months after section 88 was written a couple of weeks ago as we studied section 88, that section is packed with light. In fact, 27 times in section 88, the Savior teaches about light. Now, a few months later, he’s saying, listen, you’re walking in darkness. I really believe one of the most powerful principles of repentance is the difference between light and darkness.

                                           00:43:11             Elder Hales said this because I’ve wondered about that phrase. What does it mean to walk in darkness at noonday which the Savior’s connecting to these saints. Elder Hales said this in general conference, are we walking in darkness at noonday by refusing to see by the light of modern prophecy? If we ignore the promptings of the Holy Ghost, the Spirit will fade. Our agency will be limited or lost, and we will lose our confidence and ability to act. We will be walking in darkness at noonday. Elder Hales gives a couple of sweet insights that if we’re not careful, we will not see the light that comes through modern prophecy and we will not see the light of the Spirit. Now, just as a review in section 88, I want to read a bunch of phrases from the Savior and what he teaches about light because it’s so close to the timeline of what he’s teaching now.

                                           00:44:10             In sections 94 through 97, verse seven of section 88, Christ is in the sun and the light of the sun. Verse eight, as also Christ is in the moon and the light of the moon. Verse nine, as also he is the light of the stars. Verse 11, and the light which shineth, which giveth you light is through him who enlighteneth your eyes. Verse 13, he is the light which is in all things. Verse 50, I am the true light that is in you, verse 67, and if your eyes be single to my glory, your whole body shall be filled with light and there shall be no darkness in you. Verse 86, at the end, you’ll see the last four words, until the Lord comes. Then verse 87, for not many days hence, and the earth shall tremble to and fro as a drunken man and the sun shall hide his face and shall refuse to give light.

                                           00:45:26             Then that little c next to the sun cross references to section 133 verse 49 that says, so great shall be the glory of his, Christ’s presence, that the sun shall hide his face in shame. What a beautiful principle the Savior’s reminding us concerning Christ and light. In fact, I find it interesting in third Nephi chapter one, verse 15, you’ll remember that the night that Christ is born on the other side of the earth, as we study the Book of Mormon, what’s the sign that he gives the saints in the Book of Mormon concerning his birth? Verse 15. For behold, at the going down of the sun, there was no darkness. Verse 19, it came to pass that there was no darkness in all the night, but it was light as though it was midday. Isn’t that interesting that one of the beautiful signs that the Savior is giving that Jesus Christ is born in the earth is a night without the sun. SUN, but yet there is still light as though it was midday.

                                           00:46:45             Interestingly enough, years later in 35, chapter eight verses 20 to 23, it’s now the sign of his death on the other side of the world. Can you remember what the sign is that he gives there? There’s darkness. Do you know this third Nephi chapter 11, verse 11 one of the very first things that the Savior says about himself is, behold I am the light of the world. I’m so thankful to know that we can live in a day like we do today with so much light, so many opportunities for the power of the Holy Ghost to build us. We have temples, we have scriptures, we have covenants, we have ordinances. Now, you look at 1833 and all of the incredible things that have happened in the early years of the church, the appearance of the Father and the Son, the restoration of the priesthood, the coming forth of the Book of Mormon and the organization of the church of Jesus Christ, and you can almost sense the Savior saying, you are living in a time of light. May we today even recognize the beauty and the light of Jesus Christ that we have in our hearts and in our souls, and even if we’re not careful today amongst all of this light that the Savior offers, which is his light, there are some if we’re not careful, that we will maybe walk in darkness at noon day and that we don’t see the majesty of the moment that we live in and what a beautiful time to be alive.

John Bytheway:               00:48:22             I love the phrase that Elder Uchtdorf used about living beneath our privileges. That to me is another way of saying, we’re walking in darkness at noon day. You’re missing all of this light. Build the temple. I want to give you more light.

Hank Smith:                      00:48:40             Think of our day, how much light and truth is available at all times. Can you imagine telling someone in the ancient world, I’ve got all the sacred writings of prophets on this little device whenever I want them, I don’t have to go to the synagogue. I don’t have to have someone read it to me. It’s in my language and it’s available at all times.

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     00:49:11             Yeah, and that might be part of what the Savior’s warning them about and quite honestly warning us about today is that spiritually eclipse with the eclipse being something is in the way of the light of the sun. That creates maybe darkness in my life that we would avoid those things and step outside into the light of the Savior. Don’t allow anything to block the light of the sun. We see in those verses in section 88 that the Savior is the light of the sun and the light of the moon. One of the quiet moments I continue to have in my life is seeing the sun and the light of the sun and sensing the power of the Son, the Savior. We have a hot tub at our home and we’ll often get in the hot tub at night. There’s something special about looking up and even seeing the moon at night, recognizing the light of the moon is really light reflected from the sun that the light of the sun literally is the light of the moon. I’m thankful that even at night the Savior allows us to see his light.

Hank Smith:                      00:50:27             Someone said to me once, I think it was Todd Parker, he said, look at the full moon there, there’s 12 of those a year and I said, what do you mean? He said, well, there’s 12 full moons that basically witness to us, you can’t see the sun, but I can and I’ll reflect that light onto you, and I thought, hmm, I wonder if the Lord did that on purpose.

John Bytheway:               00:50:49             The theme for the young men and young women this year is, look unto me in every thought, doubt not fear not from section six. As a matter of fact, just last night I got to meet with the Riverton, Wyoming stake young women. The sun was hitting me up at Heber Valley camp. I asked them, do you guys know who Helen Keller is? and we talked about Helen Keller for a minute, who could not see, who could not hear. My dad had us watch this movie when we were kids called The Miracle Worker about Anne Sullivan, her teacher. She put one hand under the water in a water pump. Her teacher would like try to sign something in her hand. There is an amazing moment in the movie where little girl Helen Keller connects what’s going on in her right hand with what’s going on in her left hand, this moment of recognition, and then Helen Keller about wears Anne Sullivan out running around to different parts of the yard.

                                           00:51:50             Give me this sign for a tree. How do you spell tree? You know? How do you sign tree? How do you sign grass? Just running around. Helen Keller became this wonderful, powerful woman. She said something later in her life, which I think is so beautiful. She said, when you face the sun, the shadows of discouragement fall behind you. I asked the young women to change SUN like you just did, Clint to SON. When you face the Son, the shadows of discouragement fall behind you. Yeah, it’s true both ways, isn’t it? Here he is calling us our friends, and I want you to face me. Look unto me in every thought, doubt not, fear not, the shadows fall behind you. Isn’t that an interesting thought?

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     00:52:39             Yeah. I love that. It’s those small and simple things I think that are those that make the difference where we can feel the light. I think John and Hank, what you do, what you allow us to learn because of your insights and the guests that you bring. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve been mowing my lawn, how many times I’ve been cleaning around the house, how many times I’ve been driving to work in a truck. I have felt the light of the Son because of things that you’ve taught or those who have been with you have taught. I think this is a great application is finding those times in the day to listen, to ponder, to study, to slow down. Those are the moments, at least for me, that I can feel the light of the Savior and feel his goodness.

Hank Smith:                      00:53:29             Yeah, I have about a 20 minute drive to BYU. It really changes my day, what I listen to. I can listen to a conference talk in that 20 minutes, I could listen to really angry talk radio, I could listen to music. I could listen to a sports station. How much light I choose in those 20 minutes is going to impact the rest of my day. My wife says it this way, why are we digging around in the garbage when the pantry is full? What are we doing? The Lord is offering us so much yet we sometimes choose darkness, trivial things.

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     00:54:06             Something less.

Hank Smith:                      00:54:08             Yeah. Clint, this has been fantastic so far. I’m writing notes, filling up the margins here. What do you want to do next?

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     00:54:18             Let’s go to section 97 again, we’re August of 1833. There’s been some good changes, they’re moving forward, having received the chastening of the Lord and acting accordingly, you’ll notice in section 97 there’s a pattern. Verse one. It begins, verily I say unto you, verse two, verily, verily I say unto you, verse three, behold I say unto you, verse eight, verily I say unto you, verse 10, verily I say unto you. Just in those 10 verses, you’ll see five times. The Savior says, I say unto you, I’m so thankful to know that the God of this world, the Savior of the world, he who created the world will literally say unto us. Notice in verse one of section 97, verily I say unto you, my friends, I speak unto you with my voice, even the voice of my Spirit that I may show unto you my will concerning your brethren in the land of Zion.

                                           00:55:32             Seven times in this one verse, the Savior refers to himself. In fact, in the four sections that we’re studying, sections 94 to 97 over 160 times, the Savior refers to himself, we’re so blessed to live in a day where the Savior will continue to teach us individually. Section eight verses two and three may be the most common verses used in the context of revelation. The Savior says to Joseph and Oliver in verse two, yea, behold, I will tell you in your mind and in your heart by the Holy Ghost, which shall come upon you and which shall dwell in your heart. Now, most of the time when we read that verse, if we say, what do we learn about revelation? We’ll say, well, revelation comes by the power of the Holy Ghost to the mind and to the heart, which is so true. We often skip over the third and the fourth word in that verse.

                                           00:56:38             Yea, behold, I will tell you, if you’ll notice in verse three of section eight, the Savior actually says, behold, this is the spirit of revelation. One definition we can use with revelation is when the Savior through the Spirit teaches us individually, that’s revelation. In fact, if you look at the section heading in section 94, section 95, section 96, section 97, the very first word in the section heading is the word revelation. Over 90% of the section headings in the Doctrine & Covenants begin with that one word revelation. I’m so thankful to see this pattern over and over and over. In the Doctrine & Covenants where the Lord speaks to Joseph, the Lord speaks to the prophet, but the Lord also speaks to us individually. In fact, you may recall President Nelson in April, 2020. He said this, this year we commemorate the 200th anniversary of one of the most significant events in the history of the world, namely the appearance of God the Father and his beloved Son, Jesus Christ, to Joseph Smith.

                                           00:57:58             During that singular vision, God the Father pointed to Jesus Christ and said, this is my beloved son. Hear him. That admonition given to Joseph is for each of us. We are to seek in every way we can to hear Jesus Christ who speaks to us through the power and ministering of the Holy Ghost. We remember 2020. It was consistently that message. Hear him, hear him, hear him. Gratefully led by our amazing prophet. Who’s the him in hear him? The him is the Savior. I’m so thankful that we read through these sections which are powerful. The Savior says, verily, I say unto you, we recognize that you is Joseph Smith in the early church leaders, but I testify that the Savior does the same today. President Ballard said, the Lord micromanages his church. I really believe that the Savior himself through the power of the Holy Ghost, will also micromanage our lives if we will simply do the things in our lives to hear him. That’s a common message in section 97.

Hank Smith:                      00:59:17             I’ve been quoting Elder Uchtdorf a lot today. I’m going to do so again with what you just said, Clint. He said, the everlasting and almighty God, this is back in October of 2014, the creator of this vast universe will speak to those who approach him with sincere heart and real intent. He will speak to them in dreams, visions, thoughts, and feelings. He will speak in a way that is unmistakable and transcends human experience. He will give them divine direction and answer for their personal lives. God will speak to you.

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     00:59:56             We’re so blessed, aren’t we? To live in a day where that’s emphasized by prophets, that we can hear him every day of our lives. It’s incredible.

John Bytheway:               01:00:07             It’s interesting that what brought Joseph Smith to pray was James 1:5 Ask of God. That was a youth theme years ago. Then he did, and the Lord said, this is my beloved son. Hear him. I’m thinking of all the times I say my prayers, but I don’t take time to listen and hear. I take time to ask. This President Nelson, yeah, but did you hear? That’s a good reminder.

Hank Smith:                      01:00:34             Yeah. John, as Clint was teaching us here, pointing us out, all the times I say unto you, I give to you. This is what I want. I thought of what you often say, which is the audacity of this 27-year-old farmer saying, this isn’t me. This is the first person voice of the Lord. That’s a bold claim. We all believe it.

John Bytheway:               01:01:04             I’ve actually met John the Baptist. I’ve actually met Peter, James and John. I actually saw Moses. You’re like, w-w-w-what? Wait, what? It’s not just, I saw the Father and the Son, but the story keeps going. The audacity of it. Here’s the Lord talking revelation, revelation, revelation.

Hank Smith:                      01:01:26             And you have the audacity to print it. I’m going to print this because this is the word of the Lord and Joseph Smith. You might say, you don’t believe he’s a prophet, but you can’t say, Joseph Smith didn’t believe he was a prophet. He believed it. He said, these are the words of the Lord. I’m going to put them out there. It’s bold and beautiful. Coming up in part two of this episode.

Bro. Clint Mortensen:     01:01:52             Finally, I was honest and I said, Hey, do you have a minute? So we went into his office. As we were talking, I said to him, listen, I’m so nervous. I think that seminary teachers have this Glass House syndrome that I’ve gotta be perfect, that I’m nervous about a career that’s going to cause me to literally not be able to make a mistake because I’m going to teach the gospel of Jesus Christ for the rest of my life.