Hank Smith: 00:05 Hello, everyone. Welcome back to another week of followHIM Favorites. My name is Hank Smith. I’m here with the amazing John Bytheway. Each week, we take a single question from the Come Follow Me lesson. So John, the question this week is why do we hear this phrase so often in the church, “Line upon line, precept upon precept?” It comes here from this Isaiah section we’re on this week where Isaiah says a number of times, “Line upon line, here a little, there a little.”

Hank Smith: 00:34 What does it even mean? I’ve heard it my whole life. And yet, do I really understand what it means? What does that phrase mean to you?

John Bytheway: 00:41 This is one of those things I’m so glad there’s that line because it kind of tells us the Lord is patient even with us and our learning, that we don’t get everything all at once, and that it’s not supposed to be that way. But we learn a line upon line, precept upon precept. We get something and, boy, those are wonderful moments. I learned something at seminary today. Tuck that away. Hey, I learned something a couple of days later at seminary that was great. Hey, I learned something studying my scriptures. All of that builds up.

John Bytheway: 01:09 Have you ever seen, Hank, like on a church history tour or something where they demonstrate how they used to make candles and how they take a string and dip it in the wax and then pull it up? They have to wait for it to dry. And then you dip it down, and then you have to-

Hank Smith: 01:23 And do it again.

John Bytheway: 01:23 It’s a very slow process. It reminds me of the same thing. In fact, I always think of that when the Book of Mormon talks about, “He began to wax old.” I think of candle wax. There’s just a little by little by little. I’m glad for that phrase because it’s telling us the Lord’s patient with our learning, I think. But I also think that Satan has his counterfeit, I like to call it, lie upon lie, deceit upon deceit where he doesn’t say all at once, “Yeah, go break this commandment.”

John Bytheway: 01:54 He just says, “Come down from your mountain just a little bit,” and then leads us away carefully. So in the same way, we can learn line upon line. I’m grateful for that. The Spirit doesn’t shout or send thunder and lightning. Sometimes it’s just a tiny little line, a line upon line. That’s what I think. What do you think?

Hank Smith: 02:12 A little bit at a time. In my experience, that’s most often how revelation has come in my life. There have been times of wowzer, holy, that was, wow, revelation. But those seem to be more rare, where my learning, my testimony, the things I understand have just come a little bit at a time. I think Elder Bednar described it as the rising of the sun. It just slowly gets brighter, almost imperceptible that it’s coming. It takes a lot of patience learning this way.

Hank Smith: 02:44 We live in a world of impatience, of instant messaging and download that right now and Google that. I want five billion answers in 2.1 seconds. We live in a world that wants answers right now, and the Lord is saying, “That’s not the way I work. I am slow. I will give you just enough for you to think about, chew on, take in. And then you’ll be ready for your next bite. A little bit slow, take in.” You have to be careful, I think, John, because it’s so slow and imperceptible.

Hank Smith: 03:16 Sometimes the adversary comes back and says, “Oh, that wasn’t revelation,” just a lie upon lie. Let’s take that away just a little bit at a time. That wasn’t revelation. Look how slow that came. That can’t be revelation. Revelation needs to be angels and choirs, when really the Lord is telling us over and over again, especially in the Book of Isaiah, “Line upon line, precept on precept, tiny bit at a time.”

John Bytheway: 03:38 You reminded me of something. I think it was David O. McKay that said this, “The Spirit speaks through the voice of the conscience.” I thought, “Oh, so when I was in high school and I went to a party and I had this thought, ‘I shouldn’t be here,’ it really sounded like my voice, but could that have been the Spirit saying, ‘John, you shouldn’t be here.'” But it sounded like me talking. I love that idea that you have the light of Christ. Maybe the Spirit speaks through the voice of the conscience at times.

John Bytheway: 04:11 I think maybe, Hank, we use that … Book of Mormon, I was at Moroni 7, “Does it invite you to do good and to love God and to serve Him? Then you can know that that was from God.” That’s a really helpful key also in the whole line upon line, understanding that.

Hank Smith: 04:25 Absolutely. So when it comes to spiritual answers, I think, John, when it comes to wisdom, not information, you can get information as quick as you want. But if you want wisdom, you’re going to have to be patient. You’re going to have to be willing to do it the Lord’s way, line upon line, precept on precept.

John Bytheway: 04:43 If any of you lack information, let him ask of Google. If any of you lack wisdom, that is an entirely different question. See James 1:5. This is what I tell my Gen Z students, Hank. I say, “Sometimes I worry for your generation because you want Google speed answers to golden questions.” The golden questions are the where did I come from? Why am I here? What is a good life? What is a good person? Is God real? Those come in God’s time, not in Google’s time.

Hank Smith: 05:11 That’s exactly right. When you read Joseph Smith-History, he said, “He answered my questions, told me many other things, which I cannot write at this time, and sent me on my way.” He didn’t say, “Okay, Joseph, we’re going to need barcodes on the temple recommends. You’re going to have to outline the new For Strength of Youth program.” He didn’t lay out everything. He said, “Let me give you just enough for you to move forward a couple of steps and be watchful and ready. More will come later.” So learn to be patient, and I think you’re going to learn the voice of revelation, how it speaks.

Hank Smith: 05:42 We hope you’ll join us on our full podcast. It’s called followHIM. We’re in the Book of Isaiah this week. Come on. I know that sounds enticing. Come on over and see what you think. And then join us next week for another followHIM Favorites.